Obama’s ‘Moderate’ Syrian Rebels Are Nowhere to Be Found — Interview with Author and Irish Journalist in Middle East, Patrick Cockburn on The Real News Network Sept 14, 2014

Click for The Real News Network video Interview of PATRICK COCKBURN

Patrick Cockburn = ISIS can only be defeated by an end to the civil war in Syria

Patrick Cockburn = Four books on Iraq’s recent history. Latest book is “The Jihadis Return: ISIS(L) and the New Sunni Uprising.”

JESSICA DESVARIEUX, TRNN PRODUCER: Days after President Obama ordered airstrikes for the first time in Syria against ISIS, the CIA now says there are twenty to thirty thousand ISIS(L) fighters. That’s almost three times larger than previous intelligence reports. WHAT?

NOW Saudi Arabian government, who BUILT AND FUNDS ISIS(L), will supposedly host a training program for so-called moderate Syrian rebels. (WHAT A JOKE!)

Also, the MILITARY DICTATORSHIP in Egypt + Jordan + Lebanon + all 6 BIG OIL MONARCHICAL DICTATORSHIPS (Gulf Cooperation Council) agreed to contribute something (UNDER MASSIVE USA PRESSURE) in the SYRIA-IRAQ WARS!

Patrick Cockburn has been a correspondent for The Independent of London, mainly in the Middle East, since 1990. He’s done a lot reporting on the ground in Syria. Who are these so-called moderate Syrian rebels Obama keeps referring to?

COCKBURN: They scarcely exist on the ground — the extraordinary things about the plan Obama announced to combat ISIS(L). Nobody can find the Syrian Moderates. The main military force in Syria is the Syrian army of the Syrian government. Their Opposition is ISIS and other AQ groups all funded by QATAR AND SAUDI ARABIA.

COCKBURN: If everything depends on NON-EXISTENT moderates vetted and trained in Saudi Arabia [ISIS(L) CENTRAL] + These poor moderate guys are going to fight WAHABI CRAZED MURDERS in NOT only ISIS(L) but also in the well trained Syrian Army is really not a policy. It’s kind of make-believe.

DESVARIEUX: Saudi Arabia has long been considered a major source of funding for AQ CONTRACT MURDERERS and now ISIS(L) CONTRACT MURDERERS. And as revealed by WikiLeaks, officials like Hillary Clinton have also called the Saudi kingdom a major source for terrorism. So why would the U.S. continue to agree to host this training program there?

COCKBURN: It’s pretty extraordinary (ODD) the USA relationship with Saudi Arabia that funded 9ll. Before 9ll USA has a tolerant attitude toward Saudi Arabia. AQ Contractors were originally very much a Saudi outfit under OBL, a Saudi family member. 15 of 19 hijackers were Saudi. The money came from Saudi Arabia. Even after 9ll, the Saudis support AQ CONTRACT MURDERERS and the USA ignored and even tolerated that insanity. This is one of the reasons that ISIS(L) was able to grow as a sort of super SAUDI-AQ, far bigger, even more violent, and very effective using ANCIENT WAHABISM PHILOSOPHY OF OVERWHELMING FORCE AND MURDERS PERHAPS TRAINED BY ERIK PRINCE IN United Arab Emirates.

DESVARIEUX: This super AQ is ISIS(L) but the CIA is saying they are 10 TIMES THE FORCE THEY IDENTIFIED BEFORE — Instead of 2,000 now they are saying 20,000 or 30,000. WHY SUCH A POOR FIRST ESTIMATE OR WHY SUCH AN INFLATED ESTIMATE NOW? But it seems sort of the timing of these figures coming out now might be a little suspicious to some folks.

COCKBURN: I’d say they’re thirty to fifty thousand — A couple Thousand took Mosul, but ISIS(L) now occupies Sunni territory where 5 or 6 MILLION Iraqis loved Saddam, so Thousands joined ISIS(L) immediately — many leaving the Iraqi Army and now FUNDED by BIG OIL DICTATORS. It’s an area bigger than Michigan, and great for recruiting. They were trained by USA plus they have the money to pay these people. I’m amazed the CIA thought that there were so few, but the number has certainly increased enormously.

DESVARIEUX: You mentioned they’re payed by ISIS(L), but is there any other draw for these Sunnis to join up?

COCKBURN: Sure there is Sunni support for ISIS(L). This is very important to the Sunni community which was brutally treated under USA chosen SHIITE REGIME which is very bigoted — Sunnis are far more frightened of the Shia government in Baghdad plus they are frightened of the Assad government in Damascus. So they choose ISIS, because it comes from their own community. ISIS(L) is the Sunni Arab community in Iraq and Syria and it has deep support from vast numbers of young, unemployed, hopeless young Sunni men who need an opportunity to surviver — maybe $400/month so they will join this victorious winning army. A lot of people like to join the winning side.

DESVARIEUX: Patrick news coming out of Turkey is that they will NOT allow USA to use its airbases for military operations against ISIS. What role has Turkey played in recent years?

COCKBURN: Turkey’s role is very significant to what happens in Syria — a pretty maligned role. The border between Turkey and Syria is about 560 mile long. ISIS(L) foreign fighters are streaming into Syria through Turkey, including suicide bombers blowing up markets and civilians in Baghdad and elsewhere. The Turkish border has tightened up a bit (AFTER THE SARIN GAS CROSSED) over the last ten months, but you can still get across — Now instead of about $10 it costs you about $25 to cross. So it’s still possible. The U.S. will put a lot of pressure on it to close so it’ll get a lot more difficult. But I doubt if they can close it now.

DESVARIEUX: What are you tracking? What should people be paying attention to as the story develops?

COCKBURN: To cut through all this propaganda of USA we’ve heard about driving back ISIS and destroy it — It is really a rather messy plan to contain ISIS(L) using U.S. airstrikes and those MYTHICAL MODERATES ON THE GROUND!

COCKBURN: BOMBS can be quite effective if ISIS fighters are on the road, if they’re heading for Baghdad, if they’re heading for Erbil, Kurdish capital, or even Aleppo–they’re about 30 miles from Aleppo — Biggest city in Syria. So U.S. airstrikes are kind of effective against columns of moving vehicles on the roads.

COCKBURN: But BOMBS from the air are less effective for everything else — a guerrilla army doesn’t necessarily move on the roads and doesn’t have headquarters. There’s been talk of striking at headquarters to eliminate their supplies. But with NO headquarters its like Vietnam, or the Russians found in Afghanistan. It’s difficult to use air power and BOMBS effectively against a guerrilla army when you don’t know where the guerrillas are.

DESVARIEUX: So Patrick, what do you see as a solution?

COCKBURN: I think the most important thing to do is to try and bring the war in Syria to an end by a ceasefire or some other means since that is what is destabilized Iraq. Iraq was pretty bad under Maliki’s extremely corruption, but it was beginning to stabilize in 2011. What destabilized it was the [CIA-NGOs MOTIVATED] war in Syria that was an uprising of the Sunni Arabs and that spilled over to the Sunni Arab minority in Iraq. Iraqi politicians said that if this war goes on in Syria, that’s it for us — It’s going to destabilize Iraq. It’s going to restart the Civil War here. And they were dead right.

COCKBURN: Washington and London who motivated the CIA and NGOs to use Sunni unrest and high food costs to overthrow Assad so Iraqi Politicians were ignored or not being taken seriously. USA and UK are culpable for what’s happened in Syria and Iraq. [Perhaps they wanted this war to SPLINTER Syria and Iraq into weak failed states they could DOMINATE and EXPLOIT!]

COCKBURN: What you need to do is bring the war to an end by some sort of negotiation between Assad and the local Sunni opposition (lawyers, teachers, citizens). Maybe people will hold in each area they have and just stop shooting. And then you can have some sort of coalition against ISIS(L) BIG OIL FUNDED MURDERERS. But in the middle of a war, this just can’t be done. A CEASEFIRE of some kind comes first.

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